--- SAMPSA wrote --

If only someone had NT4 VMs that they're willing to totally legally transf ownership of...Netmail/email me (admin@uuhec.net

I probably have a legal copy of NT4 Server someplace...


---
* TARDIS BBS - Home of QUARKware * telnet bbs.cortex-media.info

--- POINDEXTER FORTRAN wrote --

Now I'm missing OS/2. I remember being able to make specific DOS VDMs whe

I used to support it at one of my jobs, long after it's useful life was over. I don't miss it.


---
* TARDIS BBS - Home of QUARKware * telnet bbs.cortex-media.info

Re: Re: msft does MORE for th
By: the doctor to POINDEXTER FORTRAN on Tue Nov 29 2016 09:26 pm

I used to support it at one of my jobs, long after it's useful life was over. I don't miss it.

I was a telecom manager in a former life, and afterwards did IT infrastructure consulting. There were a bunch of small Avaya phone systems set up by
systems integrators running Octel voice mail, which more often than not was OS/2 running on a beige desktop PC with no hardware redundancy whatsoever - and usually no backup.

I mean, really - at least put a RAID card in, folks!

---
þ Synchronet þ realitycheckBBS -- http://realitycheckBBS.org

Re: Re: msft does MORE for th
By: Poindexter Fortran to the doctor on Tue Nov 29 2016 04:03 pm

Re: Re: msft does MORE for th
By: the doctor to POINDEXTER FORTRAN on Tue Nov 29 2016 09:26 pm

I used to support it at one of my jobs, long after it's useful life was over. I don't miss it.

I was a telecom manager in a former life, and afterwards did IT infrastructu

re

consulting. There were a bunch of small Avaya phone systems set up by systems integrators running Octel voice mail, which more often than not was OS/2 running on a beige desktop PC with no hardware redundancy whatsoever -

and

usually no backup.

I mean, really - at least put a RAID card in, folks!

We used sun sparcstations for the longest time. Now it's Linux servers running asterisk.

-Denny
Denny's Computers - "Not profit seeking" PC Repair - http://dpccom.blogspot.com ---
þ Synchronet þ Vertrauen þ Home of Synchronet þ telnet://vert.synchro.net

Re: Re: msft does MORE for th
By: Hylian to Poindexter Fortran on Tue Nov 29 2016 20:14:55

I mean, really - at least put a RAID card in, folks!

Yup, or even software RAID + LVM and then run your BBSes as VMs on top of
that.

No more "OMG all my stuff is gone" type experiences.

Also of course RAID isn't a replacement for backups, again this is where VMs come in - they're VERY easy to backup if you can handle the (slight after the first backup) down time.

My script basically does this:

1. Suspend VM
2. Take a snapshot
3. rsync the VM dir to a local disk (this way you only copy the changed bits
of the disk images)
4. Resume VM
5. rsync the copy from the local disk to a remote box using rsync-over-ssh.

Sampsa

---
þ Synchronet þ B4BBS = London, England - b4bbs.sampsa.com (port 23/tcp)

Re: Re: msft does MORE for th
By: Sampsa to Hylian on Wed Nov 30 2016 01:59 pm

My script basically does this:

1. Suspend VM
2. Take a snapshot
3. rsync the VM dir to a local disk (this way you only copy the changed bits of the disk images)
4. Resume VM

I'm running a bare metal system; I just do a twice-weekly xcopy of the SBBS directory tree to an external drive. If the BBS box craps out, I have a VM already configured, just copy the last backup and go.

---
þ Synchronet þ realitycheckBBS -- http://realitycheckBBS.org

Poindexter Fortran wrote to Sampsa <=-

My script basically does this:

1. Suspend VM
2. Take a snapshot
3. rsync the VM dir to a local disk (this way you only copy the changed bits of the disk images)
4. Resume VM

I'm running a bare metal system; I just do a twice-weekly xcopy of the SBBS directory tree to an external drive. If the BBS box craps out, I
have a VM already configured, just copy the last backup and go.

Fair enough - I personally run a bunch of boards (main Synchronet Win32 VM, Pyfflq HQ [BBS software I wrote for fun], MBSE on an IBM mainframe emulator,
a bunch of VAX emulators etc) plus half a dozen other VMs so I'd either have
to rent a whole 42U rack in a data centre or go virtualised.

It really does make life so much easier (esp the snapshots/rollback feature: Want to try something out that might bugger up your BBS / OS? Take a snapshot, do the changes? Something borks? No problem, rollback to previous state).

I just keep seeing so many people post about losing their board to hardware failure that I'm baffled as to (even if just running on bare metal) people don't at least use RAID1...

sampsa


... MultiMail, the new multi-platform, multi-format offline reader!
--- MultiMail/Darwin v0.49
þ Synchronet þ B4BBS = London, England - b4bbs.sampsa.com (port 23/tcp)

Re: Re: msft does MORE for th
By: Sampsa to Poindexter Fortran on Thu Dec 01 2016 01:33 am

It really does make life so much easier (esp the snapshots/rollback feature: Want to try something out that might bugger up your BBS / OS? Take a snapshot, do the changes? Something borks? No problem, rollback to previous state).

I just keep seeing so many people post about losing their board to hardware failure that I'm baffled as to (even if just running on bare metal) people don't at least use RAID1...

Sampsa,

I hear ya. I am running my BBS, hub, and everything else using VirtualBox (which is free) on an Ubuntu Desktop install (again, free). I use cron jobs for snapshots. I have 2 Linux BBS's running Ubuntu Server console, and my Windows SBBS isntall, all within VMs. I have snapshots so If I lose something, no
big deal, and they are stored on offline media. Wouldnt be wise store your snapshots on the same drive as your files, to avoid hardware failure, and at least run raid 1.

If you do this, you will most likely never lose data. Plus I do full ZIP backups rotating nightly, just in case, stored on another place.

This is not hard at all to do, and you'll never lose anything. Plus, heck, its all free. Why not? Use Ubuntu (I know there are others) but ubuntu is simple, and easy to install and use. Use VirtualBox. And figure out cron. All you
need.

-Ayex

-Ayex

---
þ Synchronet þ -=- The ByteXchange BBS | bbs.thebytexchange.com -=-

Re: Re: msft does MORE for th
By: Sampsa to Poindexter Fortran on Thu Dec 01 2016 01:33 am

Fair enough - I personally run a bunch of boards (main Synchronet Win32 VM, Pyfflq HQ [BBS software I wrote for fun], MBSE on an IBM mainframe emulator, a bunch of VAX emulators etc) plus half a dozen other VMs so I'd either have to rent a whole 42U rack in a data centre or go virtualised.

My mother gave me the gift of Networking for Christmas - I told her I wanted to run some cabling in my house to replace the powerline adapters that go wonky when the christmas lights go up (interference!)

I'm going to run a CAT 6 cable from my storage space to my office, run coax cable for Comcast to the space, and run a phone line into there. Set up a Lack Rack in the storage space and get a cheap server. Move the cable modem in there and light up the phone lines - right now I'm using cordless phones and extension handsets instead of the phone lines.

I do miss being able to make a VM snapshot before updating SBBS. Much less stress knowing I could roll back in a minute.

---
þ Synchronet þ realitycheckBBS -- http://realitycheckBBS.org

My mother gave me the gift of Networking for Christmas - I told her I wanted to run some cabling in my house to replace the powerline adapters that go wonky when the christmas lights go up (interference!)

I'm going to run a CAT 6 cable from my storage space to my office, run coax cable for Comcast to the space, and run a phone line into there. Set up a Lack Rack in the storage space and get a cheap server. Move the cable modem in there and light up the phone lines - right now I'm using cordless phones and extension handsets instead of the phone lines.

I've been considering doing that myself. I've been using a couple of powerline adapters that work much of the time, but they get disconnected occasionally. I haven't run cabling through walls before and would need to research the best way to do that. All I'd really want is a network cable going from one jack in a room upstairs to a jack in a room downstairs so I could connect the network switch upstairs directly to the router downstairs. Seems like that shouldn't be too complicated to do.

Nightfox

---
þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com

Re: Re: msft does MORE for th
By: Nightfox to Poindexter Fortran on Thu Dec 01 2016 10:56 am

I've been considering doing that myself. I've been using a couple of powerline adapters that work much of the time, but they get disconnected occasionally. I haven't run cabling through walls before and would need to research the best way to do that. All I'd really want is a network cable going from one jack in a room upstairs to a jack in a room downstairs so I could connect the network switch upstairs directly to the router
downstairs. Seems like that shouldn't be too complicated to do.

there's tons of options for you. you can even run it along molding.
what i did was just drill a few holes through the floors and i keep everything in the basement.
---
þ Synchronet þ ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::

Re: Re: msft does MORE for th
By: Nightfox to Poindexter Fortran on Thu Dec 01 2016 10:56 am

research the best way to do that. All I'd really want is a network cable going from one jack in a room upstairs to a jack in a room downstairs so I could connect the network switch upstairs directly to the router downstairs. Seems like that shouldn't be too complicated to do.

It all depends on your house. If you're on one floor and have a basement, you've got it made. You can mount a surface jack on the baseboard, go under the house, and pop back up in the other room.

Since you're on separate floors, it might be easier to follow the cable, if you have it, or to go along the outside of the house. Fishing wires through walls can get hairy.

---
þ Synchronet þ realitycheckBBS -- http://realitycheckBBS.org

Nightfox wrote to Poindexter Fortran <=-

I've been considering doing that myself. I've been using a couple of powerline adapters that work much of the time, but they get
disconnected occasionally. I haven't run cabling through walls before
and would need to research the best way to do that. All I'd really
want is a network cable going from one jack in a room upstairs to a
jack in a room downstairs so I could connect the network switch
upstairs directly to the router downstairs. Seems like that shouldn't
be too complicated to do.

I had to ditch my powerline adapters and run a Cat 5 through the middle of the house to join the 2 halves of the network. Much better result. :)
... Yes, but you're taking the universe out of context.
--- MultiMail/Win32 v0.49
þ Synchronet þ Freeway BBS in Bendigo, Australia.

Ayex wrote to Sampsa <=-

I hear ya. I am running my BBS, hub, and everything else using
VirtualBox (which is free) on an Ubuntu Desktop install (again, free).
I use cron jobs for snapshots. I have 2 Linux BBS's running Ubuntu
Server console, and my Windows SBBS isntall, all within VMs. I have snapshots so If I lose something, no big deal, and they are stored on offline media. Wouldnt be wise store your snapshots on the same drive
as your files, to avoid hardware failure, and at least run raid 1.

Totally agreed. Be careful with really old snapshots, sometimes they get
"out of date" and are hard to roll back to.

If you do this, you will most likely never lose data. Plus I do full
ZIP backups rotating nightly, just in case, stored on another place.

Good idea but backing up a RUNNING VM is a bad idea - the backup is more
than likely to not work, even with snapshots..

This is why I always do:

1. Take snapshot of the running VM.
2. Pause VM
3. rsync the whole thing to an external drive (way faster than just a
copy since it only copies the modified parts).
4. Resume VM
5. rsync-over-ssh the copy from the external drive to a separate box
more or less dedicated to backup (Ubuntu 16.04 with a ZFS tank with
compression enabled so need to ZIP anything etc).

This is not hard at all to do, and you'll never lose anything. Plus,
heck, its all free. Why not? Use Ubuntu (I know there are others) but ubuntu is simple, and easy to install and use. Use VirtualBox. And
figure out cron. All you need.

Yeah I don't get why this isn't the standard modus operandi for everyone
but there you go..

Sampsa


... MultiMail, the new multi-platform, multi-format offline reader!
--- MultiMail/Darwin v0.49
þ Synchronet þ B4BBS = London, England - b4bbs.sampsa.com (port 23/tcp)

Poindexter Fortran wrote to Sampsa <=-

My mother gave me the gift of Networking for Christmas - I told her I wanted to run some cabling in my house to replace the powerline
adapters that go wonky when the christmas lights go up (interference!)

I'm going to run a CAT 6 cable from my storage space to my office, run coax cable for Comcast to the space, and run a phone line into there.
Set up a Lack Rack in the storage space and get a cheap server. Move
the cable modem in there and light up the phone lines - right now I'm using cordless phones and extension handsets instead of the phone
lines.

Ah ok, I use a Skype base station with cordless handsets for the whole
house - I've got dial-in numbers in the US, UK and Finland and the 10 euro "10,000 minutes to anywhere in the world" plan.

I could use SIP etc but this was just one of those "Type in your credentials and you're good to go" setups, has worked great since 2009.

Sampsa

... MultiMail, the new multi-platform, multi-format offline reader!
--- MultiMail/Darwin v0.49
þ Synchronet þ B4BBS = London, England - b4bbs.sampsa.com (port 23/tcp)

Re: Re: msft does MORE for th
By: Sampsa to Ayex on Fri Dec 02 2016 04:22 pm

Yeah I don't get why this isn't the standard modus operandi for everyone but there you go..

Momentum. I still like running dedicated hardware for the BBS, been doing that since 1991.

---
þ Synchronet þ realitycheckBBS -- http://realitycheckBBS.org

--- POINDEXTER FORTRAN wrote --

I was a telecom manager in a former life, and afterwards did IT infrastruc consulting. There were a bunch of small Avaya phone systems set up b
systems integrators running Octel voice mail, which more often than not wa OS/2 running on a beige desktop PC with no hardware redundancy whatsoever usually no backup

What fun. (:


---
* TARDIS BBS - Home of QUARKware * telnet bbs.cortex-media.info

--- POINDEXTER FORTRAN wrote --

Yeah I don't get why this isn't the standard modus operandi for every but there you go.

Momentum. I still like running dedicated hardware for the BBS, been doing since 1991

I run my BBS on whatever busted up old laptop I happen to have at the moment. This one is actually pretty good.

As far as backing it up goes, I have a script that pretty much recreates the configuration for me, so it's easy to just rebuild it if it breaks.


---
* TARDIS BBS - Home of QUARKware * telnet bbs.cortex-media.info