• desktop enviornment

    From Ronald Reid@VERT to All on Wed Aug 7 16:28:53 2013
    You know I recently switched to KDE and I must say I love it. I'm running a decent system so I dont experience any lag...The window management is great, however, I am not a fan of Ktorrent. I removed it and went to transmission-gtk (for some reason k torrent has slower download speeds). Other than that it is great.

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  • From Nightfox@VERT to Ronald Reid on Wed Aug 7 19:49:12 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Ronald Reid to All on Wed Aug 07 2013 16:28:53

    You know I recently switched to KDE and I must say I love it. I'm running a decent system so I dont experience any lag...The window management is great, however, I am not a fan of Ktorrent. I removed it and went to transmission-gtk (for some reason k torrent has slower download speeds). Other than that it is great.

    I've been a longtime fan of Gnome, but I don't like the tablet-style interface they've moved toward in the past few years. It makes me want to try KDE, although after trying Mint Linux, I like the Cinnamon desktop environment (which is based on Gnome 2).

    As far as a BitTorrent client, uTorrent is nice and is now available for Linux. uTorrent has become my favorite client, at least on Windows.

    Nightfox

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  • From Corey@VERT to Ronald Reid on Wed Aug 7 20:37:38 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Ronald Reid to All on Wed Aug 07 2013 04:28 pm

    You know I recently switched to KDE and I must say I love it. I'm running a decent system so I dont experience any lag...The window management is great, however, I am not a fan of Ktorrent. I removed it and went to transmission- (for some reason k torrent has slower download speeds). Other than that it great.


    I like ubuntu 12.X with the default setups.
    no lag or anything on a p4ht with 2gigs ram

    "Practise safe Lunch, Use a Condiment"


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  • From The Millionaire@VERT to Ronald Reid on Wed Aug 7 21:04:01 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Ronald Reid to All on Wed Aug 07 2013 04:28 pm

    You know I recently switched to KDE and I must say I love it. I'm running
    a decent system so I dont experience any lag...The window management is great, however, I am not a fan of Ktorrent. I removed it and went to transmission-gtk (for some reason k torrent has slower download speeds). Other than that it is great.

    Yes. KDE is really the nicest look you get with Kubuntu.

    $ The Millionaire $
    Park Avenue Place
    Surrey, B.C., Canada
    the.millionaire@parkave.synchro.net

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  • From Chris@VERT to Ronald Reid on Thu Aug 8 00:51:00 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Ronald Reid to All on Wed Aug 07 2013 04:28 pm

    You know I recently switched to KDE and I must say I love it. I'm running a decent system so I dont experience any lag...The window management is great, however, I am not a fan of Ktorrent. I removed it and went to transmission-
    gtk
    (for some reason k torrent has slower download speeds). Other than that it
    is
    great.


    I too like KDE. It's my primary DE. It's gotten even better in Mageia 3, but there are still some quirks that have me scratching my head. Overall I really like it though.


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  • From Corey@VERT to The Millionaire on Thu Aug 8 00:45:37 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: The Millionaire to Ronald Reid on Wed Aug 07 2013 09:04 pm

    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Ronald Reid to All on Wed Aug 07 2013 04:28 pm

    You know I recently switched to KDE and I must say I love it. I'm runnin a decent system so I dont experience any lag...The window management is great, however, I am not a fan of Ktorrent. I removed it and went to transmission-gtk (for some reason k torrent has slower download speeds). Other than that it is great.

    Yes. KDE is really the nicest look you get with Kubuntu.

    $ The Millionaire $
    Park Avenue Place
    Surrey, B.C., Canada
    the.millionaire@parkave.synchro.net


    back when unix/linux came on only floppy or tape we had Motif windows.

    "Practise safe Lunch, Use a Condiment"


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  • From Poindexter Fortran@VERT to Nightfox on Thu Aug 8 01:52:46 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Nightfox to Ronald Reid on Wed Aug 07 2013 07:49 pm

    I've been a longtime fan of Gnome, but I don't like the tablet-style interface they've moved toward in the past few years.

    I'm a big fan of LXDE. it's reminiscent of old Ubuntu, it's lightweight, and Lubuntu comes loaded with it (and lighter weight apps)

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  • From Access Denied@VERT to Ronald Reid on Thu Aug 8 02:08:27 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Ronald Reid to All on Wed Aug 07 2013 04:28 pm

    You know I recently switched to KDE and I must say I love it. I'm running a decent system so I dont experience any lag...The window management is great, however, I am not a fan of Ktorrent. I removed it and went to transmission-gtk (for some reason k torrent has slower download speeds). Other than that it is great.

    Glad to hear. I love KDE. But I also love Ktorrent, and have never had issues with the speeds. So I'm not sure as to what you're getting at with that part of it. It should be no different from any other torrent client. You get the speeds that are offered by the people/systems you're getting it from.

    Regards,
    Nick


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  • From Access Denied@VERT to Nightfox on Thu Aug 8 02:10:35 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Nightfox to Ronald Reid on Wed Aug 07 2013 07:49 pm

    I've been a longtime fan of Gnome, but I don't like the tablet-style interface they've moved toward in the past few years. It makes me want to try KDE, although after trying Mint Linux, I like the Cinnamon desktop environment (which is based on Gnome 2).

    If you try KDE, you probably won't be disappointed whatsoever. Mint Linux is just a colorful Ubuntu. KDE is a whole different experience (usually for the better, IMO).

    As far as a BitTorrent client, uTorrent is nice and is now available for Linux. uTorrent has become my favorite client, at least on Windows.

    Agreed. And now that you mention it's available for Linux, Ktorrent will be shoved down the drain. Utorrent has always been my favorite as well.

    Regards,
    Nick


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  • From Nightfox@VERT to Access Denied on Thu Aug 8 07:51:24 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Access Denied to Nightfox on Thu Aug 08 2013 02:10:35

    If you try KDE, you probably won't be disappointed whatsoever. Mint Linux is just a colorful Ubuntu. KDE is a whole different experience (usually for the better, IMO).

    I tried KDE once around 12 years ago and thought it was too much like Windows, which is why I switched to Gnome. At the time, I had read that being Windows-like was one of KDE's goals, because they wanted to make it easier for Windows users to switch to Linux. I suppose it would be worth giving it a try again though..

    Nightfox

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  • From Access Denied@VERT to Nightfox on Thu Aug 8 23:09:34 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Nightfox to Access Denied on Thu Aug 08 2013 07:51 am

    I tried KDE once around 12 years ago and thought it was too much like Windows, which is why I switched to Gnome. At the time, I had read that being Windows-like was one of KDE's goals, because they wanted to make it easier for Windows users to switch to Linux. I suppose it would be worth giving it a try again though..

    That may very well be the case. If it is, my question would be what's wrong with the Windows GUI? I actually happen to really like Windows 7's GUI. That makes KDE a shoe-in for me to enjoy using it as well, I suppose. Then again, there's plenty of themes out there to change the style of any desktop environment. You can make Gnome look like KDE, and vice versa. You can make them both look like OSX, and there's probably some crazy person that made a theme to reflect Windows 3.1. lol

    I do like your last sentence, though. Everything is worth giving a try at least once. If you don't like it, you don't ever have to use it again. :)

    Regards,
    Nick


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  • From Nightfox@VERT to Access Denied on Fri Aug 9 07:34:00 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Access Denied to Nightfox on Thu Aug 08 2013 23:09:34

    That may very well be the case. If it is, my question would be what's wrong with the Windows GUI? I actually happen to really like Windows 7's

    Nothing is wrong with a Windows GUI. But when I was first really getting into Linux about 12-13 years ago, I wanted something different than Windows (which was my main OS at the time). In the Microsoft-dominated home computer market, I was mainly just curious to see what else existed. Since KDE was (at least initially) designed to look a lot like Windows, I wasn't really interested in it at first.

    Since I was curious about other operating systems, around that time I had tried out a couple others as well. At one point, I had 4 operating systems installed on my PC (Windows, Linux, OS/2, and BeOS), with a boot manager set up to choose one. :P

    GUI. That makes KDE a shoe-in for me to enjoy using it as well, I suppose. Then again, there's plenty of themes out there to change the style of any desktop environment. You can make Gnome look like KDE, and vice versa. You can make them both look like OSX, and there's probably some crazy person that made a theme to reflect Windows 3.1. lol

    The themes were something I always liked about Gnome. For a while I used some themes that made it look similar to OS X, and I used some others as well. Now that Gnome has been drastically re-styled though (with the new "Unity" interface), I'm not sure if it supports themes anymore. I've used it at work and haven't seen configuration options for themes (I haven't really looked for such an option though).

    Nightfox

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  • From Poindexter Fortran@VERT to Corey on Fri Aug 9 14:36:00 2013
    Corey wrote to The Millionaire <=-

    back when unix/linux came on only floppy or tape we had Motif windows.

    I ran UnixWare at work and Geoworks at home back in the day. it was off running effectively the same WM in two radically different environments - custom built high-end HA server for the former and my cast off 386 for the latter.

    poindexter fortran | pfortran at realitycheckbbs dot org
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  • From Poindexter Fortran@VERT to Access Denied on Fri Aug 9 14:37:00 2013
    Access Denied wrote to Nightfox <=-

    If you try KDE, you probably won't be disappointed whatsoever. Mint
    Linux is just a colorful Ubuntu.

    Ubuntu's colorful - as long as you count purply-pinkish brown as a color!


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  • From The Millionaire@VERT to Corey on Fri Aug 9 21:28:31 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Corey to The Millionaire on Thu Aug 08 2013 12:45 am

    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: The Millionaire to Ronald Reid on Wed Aug 07 2013 09:04 pm

    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Ronald Reid to All on Wed Aug 07 2013 04:28 pm

    You know I recently switched to KDE and I must say I love it. I'm runnin a decent system so I dont experience any lag...The window management is great, however, I am not a fan of Ktorrent. I removed it and went to transmission-gtk (for some reason k torrent has slower download speeds). Other than that it is great.

    Yes. KDE is really the nicest look you get with Kubuntu.

    $ The Millionaire $
    Park Avenue Place
    Surrey, B.C., Canada
    the.millionaire@parkave.synchro.net


    back when unix/linux came on only floppy or tape we had Motif windows.

    "Practise safe Lunch, Use a Condiment"


    Wow, I remember d/l it and burning it onto a cdrom.

    $ The Millionaire $
    Park Avenue Place
    Surrey, B.C., Canada
    the.millionaire@parkave.synchro.net

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  • From Chris@VERT to Nightfox on Sat Aug 10 20:50:44 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Nightfox to Access Denied on Thu Aug 08 2013 07:51 am

    I tried KDE once around 12 years ago and thought it was too much like Window
    s,
    which is why I switched to Gnome. At the time, I had read that being Windows-like was one of KDE's goals, because they wanted to make it easier f
    or
    Windows users to switch to Linux. I suppose it would be worth giving it a t
    ry
    again though..


    I'll vouch for KDE being a great DE. Some quirks still IMO but still my go to. That said, if being windows-like is a turn off for you, you're opinion may not change much. It goes beyond windows IMO, but it's still Windows-like. It's easy enough to install though and give a shot. Who knows, you might like it in spite of Windows.


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  • From Chris@VERT to Access Denied on Sat Aug 10 21:00:02 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Access Denied to Nightfox on Thu Aug 08 2013 11:09 pm

    That may very well be the case. If it is, my question would be what's wrong with the Windows GUI? I actually happen to really like Windows 7's GUI. That makes KDE a shoe-in for me to enjoy using it as well, I suppose. Then again, there's plenty of themes out there to change the style of any desktop environment. You can make Gnome look like KDE, and vice versa. You can make them both look like OSX, and there's probably some crazy person that made a theme to reflect Windows 3.1. lol

    I do like your last sentence, though. Everything is worth giving a try at le
    ast
    once. If you don't like it, you don't ever have to use it again. :)

    Regards,
    Nick




    Hi Nick,
    My guess with a lot of people who use Windows is that it's so prevalent that they are always yearning for something a bit different. I'm not speaking for Nightfox of course (he may have other reasons entirely).

    I sometimes find the Windows interface to be a bit uninspired, but like you find Windows 7 to be a pleasant surprise. Ironically it's the massive shift of Windows 8 that has given me an ice-cream headache.

    For me I think KDE is my go to for the same reason the industry has settled on Windows for the desktop. It's proven and just works (more or less). With KDE I get the added plus of being able to customize to my hearts content and utilize the multiple desktops which come in handy. From a visual perspective Windows almost reminds of a stripped down KDE, which probably sounds like a knock but really isn't.


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  • From Jon Justvig@VERT to Chris on Sat Aug 10 21:16:00 2013
    Hi Chris and Nightfox,

    Chris had something to say to Nightfox <=-

    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Nightfox to Access Denied on Thu Aug 08 2013 07:51 am

    I tried KDE once around 12 years ago and thought it was too much like Window
    s,
    which is why I switched to Gnome. At the time, I had read that being Windows-like was one of KDE's goals, because they wanted to make it easier f
    or
    Windows users to switch to Linux. I suppose it would be worth giving it a t
    ry
    again though..


    I'll vouch for KDE being a great DE. Some quirks still IMO but still my
    go to. That said, if being windows-like is a turn off for you, you're opinion may not change much. It goes beyond windows IMO, but it's still Windows-like. It's easy enough to install though and give a shot. Who knows, you might like it in spite of Windows.

    One thing I like about Linux with either Gnome or KDE is that it has a command prompt and you can do a lot of things with the old fashion "entering it in on the command prompt" while still having the GUI in the background. So it's like having the cake and eating it too! Might taste a little like plastic or glass, but you get the idea.

    ... How can men use sex to get what they want? Sex IS what they want.
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  • From Nightfox@VERT to Chris on Sat Aug 10 23:21:16 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Chris to Access Denied on Sat Aug 10 2013 21:00:02

    My guess with a lot of people who use Windows is that it's so prevalent that they are always yearning for something a bit different. I'm not speaking for Nightfox of course (he may have other reasons entirely).

    That partly is the reason I wanted to try out other operating systems. Windows was so prevalent that I was curious to see what else was out there, and what someone else's idea of an operating system looked like. I also didn't really like what Microsoft was doing with its monopoly and felt they were abusing their dominant position (for instance, aggressive marketing and deals with OEMs and requiring that OEMs not install other software that offers an alternative to what's included with Windows, such as a web browser to offer an alternative to IE - and there were other examples that I can't think of right now).

    Windows has still always been my main OS though.

    I sometimes find the Windows interface to be a bit uninspired, but like you find Windows 7 to be a pleasant surprise. Ironically it's the massive shift of Windows 8 that has given me an ice-cream headache.

    I agree about Windows 7 - I like its interface, and I'm still not convinced that Windows 8's interface is the way to go on the desktop. I think Windows 8's interface works well on a tablet (at least, something with a touch screen in easy reach), but I think the traditional desktop interface is still best for a desktop computer.

    Nightfox

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  • From Chris@VERT to Jon Justvig on Sun Aug 11 14:27:04 2013
    Re: Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Jon Justvig to Chris on Sat Aug 10 2013 09:16 pm

    One thing I like about Linux with either Gnome or KDE is that it has a comma prompt and you can do a lot of things with the old fashion "entering it in o the command prompt" while still having the GUI in the background. So it's l having the cake and eating it too! Might taste a little like plastic or gla but you get the idea.

    ... How can men use sex to get what they want? Sex IS what they want.

    Exactly. It's an option you have with pretty much every DE/Window Manager on Linux. To be fair MS has the command prompt also, but it has it's limitations.

    What's nice is we will always have a full fledged terminal/shell for those of us comfortable with it while some of the desktop geared distros are bringing it closer to where newcomers don't ever need to touch a command line. Not sure if we are quite there yet, but it's gotten better.


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  • From Chris@VERT to Nightfox on Sun Aug 11 14:31:57 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Nightfox to Chris on Sat Aug 10 2013 11:21 pm

    That partly is the reason I wanted to try out other operating systems. Wind was so prevalent that I was curious to see what else was out there, and what someone else's idea of an operating system looked like. I also didn't reall like what Microsoft was doing with its monopoly and felt they were abusing their dominant position (for instance, aggressive marketing and deals with O and requiring that OEMs not install other software that offers an alternativ to what's included with Windows, such as a web browser to offer an alternati to IE - and there were other examples that I can't think of right now).


    I can remember doing the 'desktop shuffle' all the time especially early just because there were so many DEs and window managers out there. Over the last few years I've settled on KDE when I settled on Mandrake/Mandriva/and Mageia for my main OS. I still pull up other desktops just to see what direction they've taken over the years. I've been trying to give Gnome 3 a chance for instance. I'm not sure if I'm being unfair and biased or if it really is the mess of a gui it apears to be.


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  • From Nightfox@VERT to Chris on Sun Aug 11 14:14:48 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Chris to Nightfox on Sun Aug 11 2013 14:31:57

    Mandrake/Mandriva/and Mageia for my main OS. I still pull up other desktops just to see what direction they've taken over the years. I've been trying to give Gnome 3 a chance for instance. I'm not sure if I'm being unfair and biased or if it really is the mess of a gui it apears to be.

    I tend to think Gnome 3 is a mess. I don't think it works as well as classic Gnome.

    Nightfox

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  • From Access Denied@VERT to Chris on Sun Aug 11 13:56:06 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Chris to Access Denied on Sat Aug 10 2013 09:00 pm

    My guess with a lot of people who use Windows is that it's so prevalent that they are always yearning for something a bit different. I'm not speaking for Nightfox of course (he may have other reasons entirely).

    Which is true. And Gnome is a great alternative. I just like KDE better. It may be "Window-like" but it's nowhere near Windows. As you mention later, it's definitely a step up from Windows, IMO.

    I sometimes find the Windows interface to be a bit uninspired, but like you find Windows 7 to be a pleasant surprise. Ironically it's the massive shift of Windows 8 that has given me an ice-cream headache.

    The only touch screen devices I use are my phone, and our tablet. Both of them carry the latest version of Android. I still don't like Windows 8. Nor do I like the fact that they're trying to promote touch-screen desktops on desktop computers and non-touchscreen laptops.

    For me I think KDE is my go to for the same reason the industry has settled on Windows for the desktop. It's proven and just works (more or less). With KDE I get the added plus of being able to customize to my hearts content and utilize the multiple desktops which come in handy. From a visual perspective Windows almost reminds of a stripped down KDE, which probably sounds like a knock but really isn't.

    I can't disagree with this paragraph at all. :)

    I don't dislike Windows (7 at least). I actually use it quite a bit since I'm a bit of a gamer. But for every other use besides gaming.. I prefer linux. And if I am going to use a desktop on linux it's always KDE. If I need a very minimal desktop, I just don't use one. Don't really see the need for a minimal desktop on good hardware. Though if I actually had old hardware and needed one, I would use Fluxbox. The great part about it is that it's completely the user's choice what they do.

    Regards,
    Nick


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  • From Access Denied@VERT to Nightfox on Sun Aug 11 14:01:45 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Nightfox to Chris on Sat Aug 10 2013 11:21 pm

    I agree about Windows 7 - I like its interface, and I'm still not convinced that Windows 8's interface is the way to go on the desktop. I think Windows 8's interface works well on a tablet (at least, something with a touch screen in easy reach), but I think the traditional desktop interface is still best for a desktop computer.

    I got a chance to use Windows 8 for a bit this past weekend, and I have to agree, and stay with my original opinion that I don't like it.

    Basically, I was at my inlaws using a computer. I hit my website, and
    connected to my BBS via htmlterm. It seemed every time I posted a damn message, some regular button kept doing some kind of application switcher, or desktop switcher. It would flip to another desktop with something else going on. I would have to take the arrow key up to the top left and select the screen I was using. It happened over and over and I couldn't figure out what button was doing it. It was pretty irritating.

    Windows 7 will be used here until they do something about 8 and it's tablet-style crap. They need to realize there's still people out there that like to use their keyboards more than the mouse. :(

    Regards,
    Nick


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  • From Ronald Reid@VERT to Access Denied on Sun Aug 11 15:07:58 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Access Denied to Ronald Reid on Thu Aug 08 2013 02:08 am

    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Ronald Reid to All on Wed Aug 07 2013 04:28 pm

    You know I recently switched to KDE and I must say I love it. I'm runn
    ing
    a decent system so I dont experience any lag...The window management is great, however, I am not a fan of Ktorrent. I removed it and went to transmission-gtk (for some reason k torrent has slower download speeds)
    .
    Other than that it is great.

    Glad to hear. I love KDE. But I also love Ktorrent, and have never had issue
    s
    with the speeds. So I'm not sure as to what you're getting at with that part
    of
    it. It should be no different from any other torrent client. You get the spe
    eds
    that are offered by the people/systems you're getting it from.

    Regards,
    Nick


    You know I ran it head to head with Ktorrent and it was much faster with the same torrent file.

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  • From Access Denied@VERT to Chris on Sun Aug 11 22:20:52 2013
    Re: Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Chris to Jon Justvig on Sun Aug 11 2013 02:27 pm

    Exactly. It's an option you have with pretty much every DE/Window Manager on Linux. To be fair MS has the command prompt also, but it has it's limitations.

    Quite a bit of limitations, I might add. Whereas the Linux command line is the exact same as if you weren't using a desktop environment.

    What's nice is we will always have a full fledged terminal/shell for those of us comfortable with it while some of the desktop geared distros are bringing it closer to where newcomers don't ever need to touch a command line. Not sure if we are quite there yet, but it's gotten better.

    Sure. Some distros like Ubuntu, Sabayon, SuSE and others you really don't have to use the command line if you don't want to. Though even when using any of those, I prefer to install things with a command line package manager. I will never trust the GUI ones as much as I do watching everything happen on the command line.

    Regards,
    Nick


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  • From Access Denied@VERT to Chris on Sun Aug 11 22:23:14 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Chris to Nightfox on Sun Aug 11 2013 02:31 pm

    I can remember doing the 'desktop shuffle' all the time especially early just because there were so many DEs and window managers out there. Over the last few years I've settled on KDE when I settled on Mandrake/Mandriva/and Mageia for my main OS. I still pull up other desktops just to see what direction they've taken over the years. I've been trying to give Gnome 3 a chance for instance. I'm not sure if I'm being unfair and biased or if it really is the mess of a gui it apears to be.

    Heh. You're not being the least bit unfair or biased. It's definitely a mess. Some people (gnome, Windows, and maybe more) went in a direction they "assumed" would be popular in the future. Maybe on tablets and phones, but not on desktops or laptops. My opinion, of course.

    Regards,
    Nick


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  • From Access Denied@VERT to Nightfox on Sun Aug 11 22:25:58 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Nightfox to Chris on Sun Aug 11 2013 02:14 pm

    I tend to think Gnome 3 is a mess. I don't think it works as well as classic Gnome.

    Can't agree more on that one. Although I am a huge KDE supporter, Gnome 2 does work, and does work well.

    Regards,
    Nick


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  • From Access Denied@VERT to Ronald Reid on Mon Aug 12 01:10:35 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Ronald Reid to Access Denied on Sun Aug 11 2013 03:07 pm

    You know I ran it head to head with Ktorrent and it was much faster with the same torrent file.

    Running it head to head doesn't mean you're connecting to the exact same people with both clients. So I can't take that is proof by all means. Although you choose what you like better, it doesn't bother me any. I just can't see a torrent client running faster than another. It's all in who you're connected to for that torrent.

    Regards,
    Nick


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  • From Ronald Reid@VERT to Access Denied on Mon Aug 12 14:51:51 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Access Denied to Ronald Reid on Mon Aug 12 2013 01:10 am

    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Ronald Reid to Access Denied on Sun Aug 11 2013 03:07 pm

    You know I ran it head to head with Ktorrent and it was much faster wit the same torrent file.

    Running it head to head doesn't mean you're connecting to the exact same peo with both clients. So I can't take that is proof by all means. Although you choose what you like better, it doesn't bother me any. I just can't see a torrent client running faster than another. It's all in who you're connected for that torrent.

    Regards,
    Nick




    True.

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  • From Nightfox@VERT to Access Denied on Mon Aug 12 18:44:18 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Access Denied to Nightfox on Sun Aug 11 2013 14:01:45

    I got a chance to use Windows 8 for a bit this past weekend, and I have to agree, and stay with my original opinion that I don't like it.

    Basically, I was at my inlaws using a computer. I hit my website, and connected to my BBS via htmlterm. It seemed every time I posted a damn message, some regular button kept doing some kind of application switcher, or desktop switcher. It would flip to another desktop with something else going on. I would have to take the arrow key up to the top left and select the screen I was using. It happened over and over and I couldn't figure out what button was doing it. It was pretty irritating.

    Windows 7 will be used here until they do something about 8 and it's tablet-style crap. They need to realize there's still people out there that like to use their keyboards more than the mouse. :(

    Windows 8 does seem to make heavy use of keyboard key combinations, but I think most of them use the Windows Key. We've been testing our software in Windows 8 where I work for the past year or so, and I've started to get used to some of its key combinations - so when I go back to Windows 7, sometimes I try to use one of Windows 8's key combinations by habit. I still prefer Windows 7 though.

    Nightfox

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  • From Nightfox@VERT to Access Denied on Mon Aug 12 18:49:54 2013
    Re: Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Access Denied to Chris on Sun Aug 11 2013 22:20:52

    What's nice is we will always have a full fledged terminal/shell for
    those of us comfortable with it while some of the desktop geared
    distros are bringing it closer to where newcomers don't ever need to
    touch a command line. Not sure if we are quite there yet, but it's
    gotten better.

    Sure. Some distros like Ubuntu, Sabayon, SuSE and others you really don't have to use the command line if you don't want to. Though even when using any of those, I prefer to install things with a command line package manager. I will never trust the GUI ones as much as I do watching everything happen on the command line.

    I think the GUI tools work just fine. And in the *nix spirit of using and building on top of existing tools, I wouldn't be surprised if the GUI tools are actually calling the command-line tools behind the scenes. They'd have to work the same way at any rate.

    Back when I started seriously using Linux around 12 years ago, I would fiddle with the command-line configuration tools for quite a while but didn't have much luck getting things to work. Getting XFree to work was particularly bad - I'd often have a hard time getting the graphics to work properly, and when it did, it would still not be centered properly or wouldn't work at the highest resolution supported by my hardware, etc.. SuSE was the first distro I used where I was able to get XFree to work properly, due to the configuration tools provided by SuSE. I think things have gotten better since then though, as it's a lot easier to get things working in Linux these days.

    Nightfox

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  • From Nightfox@VERT to Access Denied on Mon Aug 12 18:54:34 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Access Denied to Chris on Sun Aug 11 2013 22:23:14

    Heh. You're not being the least bit unfair or biased. It's definitely a mess. Some people (gnome, Windows, and maybe more) went in a direction they "assumed" would be popular in the future. Maybe on tablets and phones, but not on desktops or laptops. My opinion, of course.

    I think that's correct. I think the people who created Gnome are following business trends. Many businesses are faced with a decision on what to bring to market and have to make bets on what to bring to market based on what people will buy, and the trend I've seen lately is that many businesses are betting on tablet-style machines and touch screens, and thus have developed GUIs that favor that type of user interaction. And understandably, companies that develop operating systems are developing their operating systems to work on both desktop and tablet computers rather than developing separate operating systems for each type of computer. I think Windows 8 and Mac OS X actually do a decent job of this - Windows 8 still has its desktop mode, and Windows 8.1 will allow you to boot directly into desktop mode if you want. Mac OS X has a tablet-style interface now, but by default OS X boots into desktop mode, and you have to switch into the other mode if you want to use it. Gnome, however, forces you to use a tablet-style interface by default, which I think is a poor implementation. It's why I now like Mint Linux, with its Cinnamon desktop environment, which is based on Gnome 2.

    Nightfox

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  • From Access Denied@VERT to Nightfox on Tue Aug 13 11:45:16 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Nightfox to Access Denied on Mon Aug 12 2013 06:44 pm

    Windows 8 does seem to make heavy use of keyboard key combinations, but I think most of them use the Windows Key. We've been testing our software in Windows 8 where I work for the past year or so, and I've started to get used to some of its key combinations - so when I go back to Windows 7, sometimes I try to use one of Windows 8's key combinations by habit. I still prefer Windows 7 though.

    It will be nice when it's moulded into something desktop users can still enjoy. Though, until then, I will also stick with Win7 on my machine here.

    Regards,
    Nick


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  • From Access Denied@VERT to Nightfox on Tue Aug 13 11:51:41 2013
    Re: Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Nightfox to Access Denied on Mon Aug 12 2013 06:49 pm

    I think the GUI tools work just fine. And in the *nix spirit of using and building on top of existing tools, I wouldn't be surprised if the GUI tools are actually calling the command-line tools behind the scenes. They'd have to work the same way at any rate.

    Yeah, they definitely work fine. I just enjoy watching things happen on the command line. You get more specific readouts and if there are any errors, the command line shows exactly what they are.

    Back when I started seriously using Linux around 12 years ago, I would fiddle with the command-line configuration tools for quite a while but didn't have much luck getting things to work. Getting XFree to work was particularly bad - I'd often have a hard time getting the graphics to work properly, and when it did, it would still not be centered properly or wouldn't work at the highest resolution supported by my hardware, etc.. SuSE was the first distro I used where I was able to get XFree to work properly, due to the configuration tools provided by SuSE. I think things have gotten better since then though, as it's a lot easier to get things working in Linux these days.

    Definitely easier these days. I had the same issues trying to get XFree and Xorg to work back in the day. Most of the time the Xorg script to do it for you never worked, so it was all manual configuration. That took entirely too much time, but I guess at least I learned something at that point. Now I'd rather have it easy. If I do want a GUI desktop, I will install something easier that would do most of it for you. I won't dig deep into setting up X anymore. lol But yeah, if I'm not using Linux in console-only (which is what I usually do), I usually don't manually install Xorg itself, configure it, and install a desktop on top of it anymore when you have distros that do all that crap for you.

    I think by now I can say I've used it long enough to bypass all that crap and just get the job done. :)

    Regards,
    Nick


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  • From Access Denied@VERT to Nightfox on Tue Aug 13 11:56:24 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Nightfox to Access Denied on Mon Aug 12 2013 06:54 pm

    - Windows 8 still has its desktop mode, and Windows 8.1 will allow you to boot directly into desktop mode if you want. Mac OS X has a tablet-style interface now, but by default OS X boots into desktop mode, and you have to switch into the other mode if you want to use it. Gnome, however, forces you to use a tablet-style interface by default, which I think is a poor implementation. It's why I now like Mint Linux, with its Cinnamon desktop environment, which is based on Gnome 2.

    Windows should be better then, if what you say is correct about version 8.1. OSX has always been okay in my book. It operates smoothly and there's never really any issues with it. I just won't spend the money on Apple products when I can get or build something cheaper with the same amount of horsepower. :)

    If I were to choose anything Gnome/Ubuntu related, it would definitely be Mint. I've just never really gotten used to apt-get since I've always been around portage, ports, or pacman. Probably why I don't use Debian based distros.

    Regards,
    Nick


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  • From Folsom@VERT to Access Denied on Tue Aug 13 15:24:04 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Access Denied to Nightfox on Tue Aug 13 2013 11:56 am

    If I were to choose anything Gnome/Ubuntu related, it would definitely be Mi I've just never really gotten used to apt-get since I've always been around portage, ports, or pacman. Probably why I don't use Debian based distros.

    I do not know the whats or hows about portage, ports, or pacman, but coming from using centos/fedora type distros, apt-get is pretty easy to convert to. The only thing that I missed was the `yum history` parts of package management. Debian also has a TUI program named aptitude that lets you navigate the package list better than anything I used in the rpm-yum world.

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  • From Nightfox@VERT to Access Denied on Tue Aug 13 18:47:12 2013
    Re: Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Access Denied to Nightfox on Tue Aug 13 2013 11:51:41

    Definitely easier these days. I had the same issues trying to get XFree and Xorg to work back in the day. Most of the time the Xorg script to do it for you never worked, so it was all manual configuration. That took entirely too much time, but I guess at least I learned something at that point. Now I'd rather have it easy. If I do want a GUI desktop, I will install something easier that would do most of it for you. I won't dig deep into setting up X anymore.

    That has been my feeling as well. I always thought I was at least learning something, and perhaps after messing with it for a while, I hoped I'd eventually know how to get it working right. :)

    I think by now I can say I've used it long enough to bypass all that crap and just get the job done. :)

    Same here. :) I think there's something to be said for software that works well and makes things easy. It's not about being a lazy user, but rather being able to be productive and not have to be held back by spending time trying to get a broken setup to work.

    Nightfox

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  • From Nightfox@VERT to Access Denied on Tue Aug 13 18:51:20 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Access Denied to Nightfox on Tue Aug 13 2013 11:56:24

    If I were to choose anything Gnome/Ubuntu related, it would definitely be Mint. I've just never really gotten used to apt-get since I've always been around portage, ports, or pacman. Probably why I don't use Debian based distros.

    Most of the package management systems seem more or less the same to me. They all have the same goals and the same problems to solve: To be able to easily figure out dependencies and install what's needed in order to install a piece of software, and not have errors in doing so. And most of them seem to operate in a similar manner to me.

    Although I'm not a big Apple fan and don't have any Apple machines at home, I think one nice thing about the OS X software management system is that it's very simple. OS X software tends to include everything that's required for it packaged together so that you don't have to worry about extra dependencies. Also, due to this, most OS X software doesn't even need an installer or un-installer - To install such software, you simply copy it to the hard drive, and to un-install it, you simply delete it. It can't really get any simpler than that.

    Nightfox

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  • From Corey@VERT to Nightfox on Tue Aug 13 19:50:30 2013
    Re: Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Nightfox to Access Denied on Tue Aug 13 2013 06:47 pm

    Re: Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Access Denied to Nightfox on Tue Aug 13 2013 11:51:41

    Definitely easier these days. I had the same issues trying to get XFree and Xorg to work back in the day. Most of the time the Xorg script to d it for you never worked, so it was all manual configuration. That took entirely too much time, but I guess at least I learned something at tha point. Now I'd rather have it easy. If I do want a GUI desktop, I will install something easier that would do most of it for you. I won't dig deep into setting up X anymore.

    That has been my feeling as well. I always thought I was at least learning something, and perhaps after messing with it for a while, I hoped I'd eventually know how to get it working right. :)

    I think by now I can say I've used it long enough to bypass all that cr and just get the job done. :)

    Same here. :) I think there's something to be said for software that works well and makes things easy. It's not about being a lazy user, but rather be able to be productive and not have to be held back by spending time trying t get a broken setup to work.

    Nightfox


    thats why I like my mac mini too.
    OSX 10 and Os9 both run on a machine with 256 megs of ram.
    I'd like to see another os do that.

    "Practise safe Lunch, Use a Condiment"


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  • From Access Denied@VERT to Folsom on Tue Aug 13 22:39:28 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Folsom to Access Denied on Tue Aug 13 2013 03:24 pm

    I do not know the whats or hows about portage, ports, or pacman, but coming from using centos/fedora type distros, apt-get is pretty easy to convert to. The only thing that I missed was the `yum history` parts of package management. Debian also has a TUI program named aptitude that lets you navigate the package list better than anything I used in the rpm-yum world.

    They're more command line package managers. Portage and Ports are compiling-style package managers, and pacman is probably just as easy as apt-get.

    I never really got into RPM based distros, even though CentOS is definitely one I want to give a try someday. Then again, If I wanted something that secure I would probably go with something like OpenBSD, just because I'd be more comfortable with it.

    Aptitude is a great GUI program, but I still can't get past NOT being able to see what is installing via the command line. I got way too used to compiling everything from scratch with portage and ports, and it has made me a very picky person. I'm pulling my own arm and leg trying to force myself to use Archlinux, since it's a binary rolling distro, so you can install an entire desktop in about 5-10 minutes, rather than the hours it took with Gentoo or BSDs. I'm over it. It's not as elite as the Gentoo/BSD guys say it is. lol

    Regards,
    Nick


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  • From Access Denied@VERT to Nightfox on Wed Aug 14 01:18:33 2013
    Re: Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Nightfox to Access Denied on Tue Aug 13 2013 06:47 pm

    That has been my feeling as well. I always thought I was at least learning something, and perhaps after messing with it for a while, I hoped I'd eventually know how to get it working right. :)

    Well, in those days we might have been learning something, but then again, we might have been waiting for the developers to come up with something easier as well!

    Needless to say, they did that somewhere along those lines, and somewhere after that, I've become fond of it. :)

    Same here. :) I think there's something to be said for software that works well and makes things easy. It's not about being a lazy user, but rather being able to be productive and not have to be held back by spending time trying to get a broken setup to work.

    Exactly. I don't have time for that crap! Gimme the goods so I can get to work on more productive things! lol

    Regards,
    Nick


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  • From Access Denied@VERT to Nightfox on Wed Aug 14 01:22:05 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Nightfox to Access Denied on Tue Aug 13 2013 06:51 pm

    Most of the package management systems seem more or less the same to me. They all have the same goals and the same problems to solve: To be able to easily figure out dependencies and install what's needed in order to install a piece of software, and not have errors in doing so. And most of them seem to operate in a similar manner to me.

    True, but when you do something like "apt-get --sync" or "apt-get -Syu" or something where you're mixing and matching apt-get with something you're a lot more used to, it tends to be (facepalm worthy) frustrating when you get an error on the command line. lol

    Although I'm not a big Apple fan and don't have any Apple machines at home, I think one nice thing about the OS X software management system is that it's very simple. OS X software tends to include everything that's required for it packaged together so that you don't have to worry about extra dependencies. Also, due to this, most OS X software doesn't even need an installer or un-installer - To install such software, you simply copy it to the hard drive, and to un-install it, you simply delete it. It can't really get any simpler than that.

    Sure. Great stuff, but I have no need to pay more for it. That's my only holdback. *shrug*

    Regards,
    Nick


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  • From Access Denied@VERT to Corey on Wed Aug 14 01:23:53 2013
    Re: Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Corey to Nightfox on Tue Aug 13 2013 07:50 pm

    thats why I like my mac mini too.
    OSX 10 and Os9 both run on a machine with 256 megs of ram.
    I'd like to see another os do that.

    Granted, most recent Windows releases probably can't (except maybe XP or 2000), but most linux installs (that don't include a huge bloated desktop environment like KDE or Gnome) can do that no problem, and there's plenty other desktop environments that are much more lightweight that can be used instead.

    Regards,
    Nick


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  • From Ronald Reid@VERT to Corey on Wed Aug 14 06:20:33 2013
    Re: Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Corey to Nightfox on Tue Aug 13 2013 07:50 pm

    Re: Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Nightfox to Access Denied on Tue Aug 13 2013 06:47 pm

    Re: Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Access Denied to Nightfox on Tue Aug 13 2013 11:51:41

    Definitely easier these days. I had the same issues trying to get XF
    ree
    and Xorg to work back in the day. Most of the time the Xorg script t
    o d
    it for you never worked, so it was all manual configuration. That to
    ok
    entirely too much time, but I guess at least I learned something at
    tha
    point. Now I'd rather have it easy. If I do want a GUI desktop, I wi
    ll
    install something easier that would do most of it for you. I won't d
    ig
    deep into setting up X anymore.

    That has been my feeling as well. I always thought I was at least learni
    ng
    something, and perhaps after messing with it for a while, I hoped I'd eventually know how to get it working right. :)

    I think by now I can say I've used it long enough to bypass all that
    cr
    and just get the job done. :)

    Same here. :) I think there's something to be said for software that wo
    rks
    well and makes things easy. It's not about being a lazy user, but rather
    be
    able to be productive and not have to be held back by spending time tryin
    g t
    get a broken setup to work.

    Nightfox


    thats why I like my mac mini too.
    OSX 10 and Os9 both run on a machine with 256 megs of ram.
    I'd like to see another os do that.

    "Practise safe Lunch, Use a Condiment"


    There are versions of linux that run on 16 GB ram [20~without a gui[21~. There are verisons with the GUI that run with as little as 64 mb ram.

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  • From Nightfox@VERT to Corey on Wed Aug 14 12:32:30 2013
    thats why I like my mac mini too.
    OSX 10 and Os9 both run on a machine with 256 megs of ram.
    I'd like to see another os do that.

    That's true, and I think it's pretty cool that OS X can run with that little RAM.

    In the late 90s, I remember when I upgraded to 32 megabytes of RAM and thought that was huge. I think I was running Windows 98 at the time. These days,
    it's getting almost common to see (high-end) machines with 16GB or even 32GB
    of RAM.

    Nightfox

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  • From Poindexter Fortran@VERT to Access Denied on Wed Aug 14 11:17:00 2013
    Access Denied wrote to Corey <=-

    Re: Re: desktop enviornment
    Granted, most recent Windows releases probably can't (except maybe XP
    or 2000),

    I think XP wants 256 to install. 2000 would definitely fit. MicroXP or a "Roll-Your-Own" cut down version of XP will run nicely in 256. I have
    MicroXP running in a 128 MB VM.

    but most linux installs (that don't include a huge bloated
    desktop environment like KDE or Gnome) can do that no problem, and
    there's plenty other desktop environments that are much more
    lightweight that can be used instead.

    Lubuntu fits nicely in 128 MB, and still gets you most of the Ubuntu "ecosystem".

    poindexter fortran | pfortran at realitycheckbbs dot org
    | http://realitycheckbbs.org

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  • From Access Denied@VERT to Ronald Reid on Wed Aug 14 14:03:55 2013
    Re: Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Ronald Reid to Corey on Wed Aug 14 2013 06:20 am

    OSX 10 and Os9 both run on a machine with 256 megs of ram.
    I'd like to see another os do that.

    There are versions of linux that run on 16 GB ram [20~without a gui[21~. There are verisons with the GUI that run with as little as 64 mb ram.

    Good point. I even remember when Ubuntu came out they promoted that it could be ran on 256mb ram.. and Ubuntu isn't very lightweight either!

    Regards,
    Nick


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  • From Access Denied@VERT to Poindexter Fortran on Wed Aug 14 19:25:25 2013
    Re: Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Poindexter Fortran to Access Denied on Wed Aug 14 2013 11:17 am

    I think XP wants 256 to install. 2000 would definitely fit. MicroXP or a "Roll-Your-Own" cut down version of XP will run nicely in 256. I have MicroXP running in a 128 MB VM.

    Nice. That MicroXP sounds tiny. Which is a good thing. :)

    Lubuntu fits nicely in 128 MB, and still gets you most of the Ubuntu "ecosystem".

    Yep. That's just with LXDE, correct? I've tried it before. The default, IMO, needs a complete overhaul, like new icons and such, but it's definitely a lot more lightweight and less demanding than Gnome or KDE.. or even XFCE these days. Heard that's getting pretty big too. :(

    Regards,
    Nick


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  • From poindexter fortran@VERT to Nightfox on Thu Aug 15 10:49:00 2013
    Nightfox wrote to Corey <=-

    In the late 90s, I remember when I upgraded to 32 megabytes of RAM and thought that was huge. I think I was running Windows 98 at the time. These days, it's getting almost common to see (high-end) machines with 16GB or even 32GB of RAM.


    I had a linux box running BIND, sendmail and providing secondary DNS and
    SMTP for my domains at the time -- a 486/66 with 32 mb of RAM.

    poindexter fortran | pfortran at realitycheckbbs dot org
    | http://realitycheckbbs.org

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  • From Poindexter Fortran@VERT to Access Denied on Thu Aug 15 09:43:14 2013
    Re: Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Access Denied to Poindexter Fortran on Wed Aug 14 2013 07:25 pm

    Nice. That MicroXP sounds tiny. Which is a good thing. :)

    Makes for a nice VM.

    Yep. That's just with LXDE, correct? I've tried it before. The default, IMO, needs a complete overhaul, like new icons and such, but it's definitely a lot more lightweight and less demanding than Gnome or KDE.. or

    Lubuntu has LXDE and a collection of lighter-weight apps (Sylpheed instead of Thunderbird, Chromium instead of Firefox, smaller terminal, smaller notepad app) and fits nicely, There's now a small software center, too - with all lightweight apps.

    I started using Lubuntu on a single-core laptop, still use it on a Core2Duo laptop with 4 GB of RAM. With a translucent task bar, my own wallpaper and Ubuntu icons, it's prettier and easier to work with than standard Ubuntu.

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  • From Corey@VERT to poindexter fortran on Thu Aug 15 15:38:43 2013
    Re: Re: desktop enviornment
    By: poindexter fortran to Nightfox on Thu Aug 15 2013 10:49 am

    Nightfox wrote to Corey <=-

    In the late 90s, I remember when I upgraded to 32 megabytes of RAM and thought that was huge. I think I was running Windows 98 at the time. These days, it's getting almost common to see (high-end) machines with 16GB or even 32GB of RAM.


    I had a linux box running BIND, sendmail and providing secondary DNS and SMTP for my domains at the time -- a 486/66 with 32 mb of RAM.

    poindexter fortran | pfortran at realitycheckbbs dot org
    | http://realitycheckbbs.org


    a lot on ISPs run on linux
    and a lot run on osx too.
    I heard of a huge system that run on a bank on mac minis.
    which is great cause they dont need special fans and can fit in small spaces.

    "Practise safe Lunch, Use a Condiment"


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  • From Access Denied@VERT to Poindexter Fortran on Thu Aug 15 20:14:28 2013
    Re: Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Poindexter Fortran to Access Denied on Thu Aug 15 2013 09:43 am

    Lubuntu has LXDE and a collection of lighter-weight apps (Sylpheed instead of Thunderbird, Chromium instead of Firefox, smaller terminal, smaller notepad app) and fits nicely, There's now a small software center, too - with all lightweight apps.

    I started using Lubuntu on a single-core laptop, still use it on a Core2Duo laptop with 4 GB of RAM. With a translucent task bar, my own wallpaper and Ubuntu icons, it's prettier and easier to work with than standard Ubuntu.

    Cool man. Whatever works best for you! I'll stick with my icons being listed under the 'ls' command and no mouse support unless I tell it to have it.

    ...for now, anyways. :)

    Regards,
    Nick


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  • From Chris@VERT to Nightfox on Sun Aug 25 21:13:19 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Nightfox to Chris on Sun Aug 11 2013 02:14 pm

    I tend to think Gnome 3 is a mess. I don't think it works as well as classi Gnome.

    Nightfox


    The more I use it (which admittedly isn't a ton), the more it feels like a solution to a problem that doesn't exist. I know they're thinking tablet with the new layout, but to be honest, I don't see it even being a fit for that.


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    telnet://bbs.dmine.net

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    http://www.delphiforums.com/prosig

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  • From Nightfox@VERT to Chris on Sun Aug 25 18:55:28 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Chris to Nightfox on Sun Aug 25 2013 21:13:19

    I tend to think Gnome 3 is a mess. I don't think it works as well as
    classi Gnome.

    The more I use it (which admittedly isn't a ton), the more it feels like a solution to a problem that doesn't exist. I know they're thinking tablet with the new layout, but to be honest, I don't see it even being a fit for that.

    I agree. Sometimes I think they change things just for the sake of changing things, even if the previous design worked just fine.

    Nightfox

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  • From Chris@VERT to Access Denied on Sun Aug 25 21:19:06 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Access Denied to Chris on Sun Aug 11 2013 01:56 pm

    I don't dislike Windows (7 at least). I actually use it quite a bit since I' bit of a gamer. But for every other use besides gaming.. I prefer linux. And I am going to use a desktop on linux it's always KDE. If I need a very minim desktop, I just don't use one. Don't really see the need for a minimal deskt on good hardware. Though if I actually had old hardware and needed one, I wo use Fluxbox. The great part about it is that it's completely the user's choi what they do.

    Regards,
    Nick



    I am keeping a couple lightweight windows managers handy although I rarely need them. I installed them to check 'em out and just left them there in case I find a need for it. I'm curious to see how the RazorQt/lxde marriage comes along in the future. I think there is a place for a lightweight KDE-like desktop for people who don't need the more sophisticated stuff.


    ------------------------------------------------------------------
    Chris Perrault
    The Diamond Mine BBS
    telnet://bbs.dmine.net

    The Programmers' SIG @ DelphiForums
    http://www.delphiforums.com/prosig

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  • From Dingo@VERT to Corey on Wed Aug 28 14:59:00 2013
    back when unix/linux came on only floppy or tape we had Motif windows

    I dropped out of college because before I began the master's program
    they had already dropped one of the classes I originally signed into it
    for: X11 programming with Motif.

    The sad part is, they didn't replace it with GTK or QT, in fact, they
    dropped all the serious C-programming on Solaris heavy hitting stuff, replacing iw tih silly linux, perl/CGI, and java stuff. Pretty sad, now
    that I'm working with peers who can't understand fundamental system
    issues because they've never had to write any C code, understand how a
    system call works, or even know the difference between a clipboard and
    a pasteboard
    ---
    [TN11.1] Archaic Binary
  • From Hustler@VERT to Nightfox on Wed Sep 4 23:36:12 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Nightfox to Chris on Sat Aug 10 2013 11:21 pm

    I agree about Windows 7 - I like its interface, and I'm still not convinced that Windows 8's interface is the way to go on the desktop. I think Windows 8's interface works well on a tablet (at least, something with a touch scree in easy reach), but I think the traditional desktop interface is still best a desktop computer.

    Nightfox

    I'm not getting this whole windows 8 thing. If it was built for a touchscreen why would you want it on a desktop? I also didn't like to give into microsofts monopoly but finally gave up when Unix like Os couldn't decide what time it was. I would go to COMPUSA and all the software was for windows with a few isles for MAC. I worked for an ISP for a few years and UNIX was great at the time but Microsoft eventually caught up. I never did like MAC although my kids love em. Now I'm the out cast with all my MS machines and software. HA!
    Regards

    HusTler

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  • From Folsom@VERT to Hustler on Thu Sep 5 06:31:05 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Hustler to Nightfox on Wed Sep 04 2013 11:36 pm

    I'm not getting this whole windows 8 thing. If it was built for a touchscree why would you want it on a desktop? I also didn't like to give into microsof monopoly but finally gave up when Unix like Os couldn't decide what time it was.

    I am not sure that I understand what you mean about the time. Do you not like the system RTC using UTC, and then translating that to local time for the user?

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  • From KF5QEO@VERT to Hustler on Mon Sep 9 07:51:31 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Hustler to Nightfox on Wed Sep 04 2013 23:36:12



    I'm not getting this whole windows 8 thing. If it was built for a touchscreen why would you want it on a desktop? I also didn't like to give
    It was actually built for the Windows Phone, part of Microsoft's belief
    that if every device / appliance runs windows, and they get you to use
    windows live for everything, then you can use your apps and files any
    where. Now you want to talk about monopoly's many folks want to slam
    their iron fist at Microsoft but close their eyes to Apple's iPhones!
    At least Microsoft doesn't force you to take out a warranty on windows
    at the time of purchase, or not be able to warranty it ever again.
    Personally, I find Microsoft has much better ethics than Apple!
    Once Jobs kicked Waz to the curb, Apple's morals went south for good!
    Unfortiantly, Microsoft is wanting to move everyone to using phone apps.
    Personally, I've grown more found of slackware again and puppy on my desktop.


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  • From Folsom@VERT to KF5QEO on Mon Sep 9 11:07:28 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: KF5QEO to Hustler on Mon Sep 09 2013 07:51 am

    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Hustler to Nightfox on Wed Sep 04 2013 23:36:12



    I'm not getting this whole windows 8 thing. If it was built for a touchscreen why would you want it on a desktop? I also didn't like to giv
    It was actually built for the Windows Phone, part of Microsoft's belief
    that if every device / appliance runs windows, and they get you to use
    windows live for everything, then you can use your apps and files any
    where.

    I have always assumed that the obvious plan is to have one compute
    device. It may be phone, or it may be a tablet, but either way, it will
    be portable. The one device would be usable all by itself, and it can be controlled by our other interface devices.

    So lets say that the tablet is our compute device, and you want to run
    an app on your phone. The phone will simply display the interface, but
    the tablet will do all of the processing. The same concept will work
    with your smart-watch, smart-eyeglass, or the keyboard-mouse-monitor
    terminal on your desk.

    If my vision of the future is correct, then Microsoft and Windows 8 are
    in a good position to own all of the markets because they have already
    created an environment where tablet/phone style apps live in harmony
    with desktop apps, and the metaphor can extend to whatever interface
    device comes down the line.

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  • From Access Denied@VERT to Folsom on Mon Sep 9 18:15:47 2013
    If my vision of the future is correct, then Microsoft and Windows 8 are
    in a good position to own all of the markets because they have already created an environment where tablet/phone style apps live in harmony
    with desktop apps, and the metaphor can extend to whatever interface device comes down the line.

    FYI, Ubuntu's "Unity" interface was out well before Windows 8 hit the shelves. Android OS was also. M$ definitely wasn't the trend setter in this case, like they have been in the past.

    Either way, I will never get rid of desktop computers. They are way better than tablets and phones, IMO.

    Regards,
    Nick


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    Synchronet thePharcyde_ >> telnet://bbs.pharcyde.org (Wisconsin)
  • From Mro@VERT to Access Denied on Mon Sep 9 20:54:00 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Access Denied to Folsom on Mon Sep 09 2013 06:15 pm

    shelves. Android OS was also. M$ definitely wasn't the trend setter in this case, like they have been in the past.

    Either way, I will never get rid of desktop computers. They are way better than tablets and phones, IMO.


    well desktop computers arent selling well and i think the gameplan is to phase them out.

    we might have to end up doing some stuff with server hardware to get that desktop experience in the future.

    personally, i hate tablets. i hate smearing my fingers on my phone. i can barely spell shit correctly on my s3. i dont want to relearn how i do things using some app so i can spell shit right.
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  • From The Millionaire@VERT to Mro on Tue Sep 10 12:59:05 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Mro to Access Denied on Mon Sep 09 2013 08:54 pm

    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Access Denied to Folsom on Mon Sep 09 2013 06:15 pm

    shelves. Android OS was also. M$ definitely wasn't the trend setter in this case, like they have been in the past.

    Either way, I will never get rid of desktop computers. They are way better than tablets and phones, IMO.


    well desktop computers arent selling well and i think the gameplan is to phase them out.

    we might have to end up doing some stuff with server hardware to get that desktop experience in the future.

    personally, i hate tablets. i hate smearing my fingers on my phone. i can barely spell shit correctly on my s3. i dont want to relearn how i do
    things using some app so i can spell shit right.

    If they phase out desktop computers, I'll go back to TV then. Call me old-fashioned but I love the desktop environment personally.

    $ The Millionaire $
    Park Avenue Place
    Surrey, B.C., Canada
    the.millionaire@parkave.synchro.net

    ---
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  • From Curly@VERT to The Millionaire on Tue Sep 10 15:32:09 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: The Millionaire to Mro on Tue Sep 10 2013 12:59 pm

    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Mro to Access Denied on Mon Sep 09 2013 08:54 pm

    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Access Denied to Folsom on Mon Sep 09 2013 06:15 pm

    shelves. Android OS was also. M$ definitely wasn't the trend setter in this case, like they have been in the past.

    Either way, I will never get rid of desktop computers. They are way better than tablets and phones, IMO.


    well desktop computers arent selling well and i think the gameplan is to phase them out.

    we might have to end up doing some stuff with server hardware to get that desktop experience in the future.

    personally, i hate tablets. i hate smearing my fingers on my phone. i can barely spell shit correctly on my s3. i dont want to relearn how i do things using some app so i can spell shit right.

    If they phase out desktop computers, I'll go back to TV then. Call me old-fashioned but I love the desktop environment personally.

    $ The Millionaire $
    Park Avenue Place
    Surrey, B.C., Canada
    the.millionaire@parkave.synchro.net


    desktops for consumers are turning into giant tablets.
    look at dell and acers stuff. looks like a tablet on a pedistal.

    "Practise safe Lunch, Use a Condiment"


    ---
    Synchronet Three Stooges - Las Vegas, Nv - tsgc.synchro.net
  • From Hustler@VERT to KF5QEO on Tue Sep 10 17:25:35 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: KF5QEO to Hustler on Mon Sep 09 2013 07:51:31

    Personally, I find Microsoft has much better ethics than Apple! Once Unfortiantly, Microsoft is wanting to move everyone to using phone apps. Personally, I've grown more found of slackware again and puppy on my desktop.

    |03 I had a few bucks to spare 2 years ago and purchased a smart phone with verizon (Nexus) a tablet (One android and one with windows ce) and two netbooks. They are all in the closet while I use my laptop with Windows 7.
    You can take that touch screen crap and stick it where the sun don't shine!

    |02 HusTler


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    Synchronet chaotic bliss - chaoticbliss.darktech.org
  • From Poindexter Fortran@VERT to Access Denied on Tue Sep 10 22:38:41 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Access Denied to Folsom on Mon Sep 09 2013 06:15 pm

    Either way, I will never get rid of desktop computers. They are way better than tablets and phones, IMO.

    I'd love to see the idea of a dockable phone. Motorola tried it a while back, and the Ubuntu One could make it work - dual core CPU and Ubuntu Linux on a phone with Micro-HDMI and Bluetooth. Plug into a monitor and pair a BT mouse and keyboard and off you go.

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    Synchronet realitycheckBBS -- http://realitycheckBBS.org
  • From Access Denied@VERT to Poindexter Fortran on Wed Sep 11 08:43:00 2013
    I'd love to see the ideaof a dockable phone. Motorola tried it a while back, and the Ubuntu One could make it work - dual core CPU and Ubuntu Linux on a phone with Micro-HDMI and Bluetooth. Plug into a monitor and pair a BT mouse and keyboard and off you go.

    That's blasphemy. How dare you! :)

    But really, no thanks. My phone does the job I need it to do, and I've never had to hook it up to a monitor. I do, however, have three monitors on my
    gaming rig now, so maybe I'm making up for lost times or something. :)

    Regards,
    Nick

    --- Mystic BBS v1.10 A37 (Linux)
    * Origin: Dark Sorrow | telnet://bbs.darksorrow.us
  • From Warp 4@VERT to Access Denied on Fri Sep 13 10:25:00 2013
    On 09-11-13, Access Denied said the following...

    But really, no thanks. My phone does the job I need it to do, and I've never had to hook it up to a monitor. I do, however, have three monitors on my gaming rig now, so maybe I'm making up for lost times or
    something. :)

    Heh three? I do well just to keep my sanity with TWO monitors on my work desktop (well, laptop really).

    --- Mystic BBS v1.10 A38 (Windows)
    * Origin: RiverNet BBS * Memphis, TN * bbs.rivernet.us
  • From Android8675@VERT to Warp 4 on Sat Sep 28 08:48:01 2013
    Re: Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Warp 4 to Access Denied on Fri Sep 13 2013 10:25 am

    On 09-11-13, Access Denied said the following...

    But really, no thanks. My phone does the job I need it to do, and
    I've never had to hook it up to a monitor. I do, however, have three
    monitors on my gaming rig now, so maybe I'm making up for lost times
    or something. :)

    Heh three? I do well just to keep my sanity with TWO monitors on my work desktop (well, laptop really).

    You need 3 otherwise your gun sights will be cut off. I use 4 myself.


    4

    2 1 3
    --
    Andy/Android8675


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  • From Nightfox@VERT to Hustler on Sat Oct 19 08:03:03 2013
    Re: desktop enviornment
    By: Hustler to Nightfox on Wed Sep 04 2013 23:36:12

    I'm not getting this whole windows 8 thing. If it was built for a touchscreen why would you want it on a desktop?

    I agree. I think Microsoft has focused too much on the tablet side. Not only is Windows 8 designed for touch screens, I think it looks ugly too - Microsoft has removed the arguably better-looking glassy and deep-looking interface with a flat interface with plain colors. I think Windows 8 looks ugly. Google and Apple seem to be doing the same with their mobile operating systems. It all just looks like crap, IMO. Even on the desktop side, Microsoft is making the user interfaces of their software flat with simple (even monochrome) colors. Microsoft's Office 2013 and especially Visual Studio 2013 just look fugly, IMO.

    It seems everyone is focused on tablets though. Everyone is saying tablets are the 'in' thing these days, and all the major companies seem to be focused on producting either tablets or software that work well on tablets, to the detriment of desktop products.

    I also didn't like to give
    into microsofts monopoly but finally gave up when Unix like Os couldn't

    I used to feel like that too.. In the 90s, I started trying some different operating systems so that I could possibly switch away from Microsoft. I occasionally used OS/2 for a little while and also started to seriously look into Linux, and I tried BeOS too (which I thought was a very promising new OS, since its GUI was simple but effective and good-looking, and it was a very fast OS too). I've been watching the Haiku project, which aims to create an open-source recreation of BeOS.

    decide what time it was. I would go to COMPUSA and all the software was for windows with a few isles for MAC. I worked for an ISP for a few years and UNIX was great at the time but Microsoft eventually caught up. I never did like MAC although my kids love em. Now I'm the out cast with all my MS machines and software. HA! Regards

    Yeah, there still seems to be much more software available for Windows (which is the main reason I continue to use Windows), but I have a feeling that situation may be changing. Apple continues to sell many of their computers and devices, and Android and Linux both have strong marketshare now as well. Also with Valve's recent announcement of SteamOS, I'm curious how gaming might change too. If gave companies start supporting Linux as a platform, then I might seriously consider switching to Linux. Currently my favorite Linux distribution is Mint, but there's certainly a lot of good Linux distributions out there. I've also had a look at FreeBSD again recently and like its UI - but I'm not sure that BSD-based operating systems are as widely supported as Linux.

    Nightfox

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